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<br/>----- Alkuperäinen viesti -----
<br/>> On Thu, 26 Nov 2009 12:15:18 +0000
<br/>> David Greaves <<a href="mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org">email@example.com</a>> wrote:
<br/>> > On Thu, 2009-11-26 at 12:33 +0100, Jeremiah Foster wrote:
<br/>> > > On Nov 26, 2009, at 12:03, Roald de Vries wrote:
<br/>> > >
<br/>> > > > Hi,
<br/>> > > >
<br/>> > > > On Nov 25, 2009, at 11:24 PM, Valerio Valerio wrote:
<br/>> > > > > Please share your opinion, we need to decide about this asap.
<br/>> > > >
<br/>> > > > Maemo's biggest competitive edge (compared to for example the
<br/>> > > > iPhone) is the freedom it offers to its users. From that point of
<br/>> > > > view the CLI apps should definitely be available.
<br/>> > >
<br/>> > > It's not that the CLI apps will be available - of course they will
<br/>> > > - it is user experience, or as the meme calls it: UX.
<br/>> > >
<br/>> > > From a user perspective, CLI tools break the UX. I say keep them
<br/>> > > only available through apt-get.
<br/>> > And what would you use for an app 'browser'?
<br/>> > In general I want to keep them away from 'end users' and keep them
<br/>> > trivially accessible by power users. I (almost) like HAM.
<br/>> "Power users" always can use the red pill mode in the application
<br/>> manager to install/browse CLI applications, upgrade libraries, and even
<br/>> get that feature called "reboot loop" ;-)
<br/>> I think that the red pill mode is really easy (and sufficient) for those
<br/>> power users, and without have to get root and go to the terminal to use
<br/>> I think that there will be a new section in the application manager
<br/>> (user/hidden) that it just shows updates but it doesn't show anything
<br/>> in the install list. I'm not sure if it is the real function of this
<br/>> section, I have only seen the git changelog, and I haven't looked more
<br/>> in depth. Perhaps, it can be useful for the "update problem".
<br/>> In my opinion If we allow CLI applications in Extras, end-users will be
<br/>> dissappointed, they will install CLI applications with this reason:
<br/>> This application is called socat: so-cat (a cat!, surely it's like a
<br/>> End-users (and start-users too) generally don't read descriptions, they
<br/>> first shoot and then ask ;-)
<br/>> When they see that the application that they installed isn't
<br/>> anywhere in a graphical form, they will be dissappointed and will say
<br/>> "Maemo apps sucks", "Maemo is only for developers". Well, they won't if
<br/>> it happens only one time, but if it happens with let's say 10-15
<br/>> applications, they will do.
<br/>> I know that if we take this decision, it's going to be difficult for
<br/>> us. In the end, we are the kind of people using these CLI utilities, but
<br/>> what would happen if the end-users were the people deciding about this?
<br/>> Would they be happy to have "sqlite" between "recorder" and "theremin"
<br/>> in the all-list?
<br/>> Can we to do a survey to the normal people (not techies) around us? Just
<br/>> ask them: "What would you think if you install an application in your
<br/>> phone (ehh, mobile computer) and it doesn't appear anywhere?"
<br/>> Of course, in a better English than mine.
<br/>> If we want to help Maemo to go mainstream (whatever it means), we
<br/>> will must take difficult decisions with some old GNU/Linux traditions,
<br/>> and this is the first decision of this kind, surely we will see more.
<br/>> Daniel Martin Yerga
<br/>> <a href="http://yerga.net">http://yerga.net</a>
<br/>who will be the first to create poll to talk.maemo.org?
<br/>One possibility would be an "apt-get ui", an app that can be used for CLI software installation. There is (solvable) problems how to poll for updates etc....
<br/>But the poll to t.m.o. Is fairly quick to create and only problem is how to get only non-techies to reply.
<br/>But the minute CLIs can be found in extras straight, it is a huge step from user friendly to geek friendly imo. K.I.S.S. Is always a good rule of thumb to begin with as long as power users have their freedom to do what they want.
<br/>Ossipena / Timo<br/></p>