[maemo-developers] Unsatisfied with bugs.maemo.org

[From: Till Harbaum / Lists]

Hi,

sorry, but i don't get your point. You say that you'd need tests and things
for the themeing and thus you don't do it at all? You mean it's acceptible
to not theme them at all and have them look ugly but it's not acceptible
to give them a quick/untested themeing? Why? You basically say "either we
do things perfectly or we do them in the worse possible way". I'd say:
If you don't support that feature, then remove it entirely from the libs 
and from the api docs. But distributing a library containing stuff you just 
won't support is pretty odd.

You could avoid a lot of internal testing if you'd actually make use of
the fact that bugs.maemo.org gives you a bunch of external testers.
Actually that's what happening here: You provide a library containing
functionality that is incomplete and untested.  And the community did 
the testing for you and now tells you that what you deliver is incomplete.

And what do you mean by wanting this to be a community project?
Is there an easy way the community can replace nokia provided core
libraries and theme files? Or do you suggest people should switch to mer
if they are unsatisfied with some half-hearted nokia implementation? 

You say you only fix those features that are actually a problem 
for your own product and you don't care  for widgets that are "only" 
used by third party applications. Are you serious? Nokia really isn't interested
in supporting third party apps? Support is only provided if there's also
a benefit for nokias own applications? Wow ...

Till

Am Freitag 05 Juni 2009 schrieb Eero Tamminen:
> Bug 4630 & 1504 are about themeing a single Gtk widget aspect.
> 
> There are many other Gtk widgets and icons which aren't (at least fully)
> themed although they otherwise work fine.  This is because it would
> require (internally):
> * UI specifications about these widget features and their themeing
> * Themeing these things (gtkrc & graphics) for all themes according
>    to the specification
> * Writing test programs for these features
>    (as they're not used by the product itself)
> * Regular testing that the widget features and themeing work
>    (in all themes) according to the specification
> 
> Which is quite a lot of extra work for things that aren't used at all
> in the product itself.  So, it's not done.
> 
> If the community wants the extra widgets / widget features and icons to
> be themed because they actually have some program(s) that use them, I
> think its better to handle that as a community project...?
> 
> 
> >> Why is there a bug reporting system if so many bugs end up with WONTFIX? This
> >> doesn't make much sense to me.
> > 
> > Again, don't kill the messenger.
> > 
> > Maemo 5 bug handling has been already a lot more efficient than in
> > previous versions, thanks to people reproducing old bugs in the
> > Fremantle pre-releases. We expect the good responsiveness to be kept
> > once Maemo 5 is launched and we get new bugs from Maemo 5 users, getting
> > the fixes out in new updates.
> > 
> > What we have is a bag of bugs still open affecting mostly Diablo.
> > Because of many reasons those bugs were not handled in time or there
> > were no resources to fix them at the time.
> 
> The main reason was that we didn't have regular pre-releases of the
> software before Fremantle.
> 
> The situation of what happens after the official release, is similar as
> with the other Linux Distros, once e.g. Ubuntu releases a new version of
> its distribution, implementing feature bugs and minor bug fixes happen
> to  the next release having new features (currently Fremantle on Maemo),
> the old release will get only bugfixes to security and other critical
> issues and eventually even those stop.  Ubuntu does new releases at
> fixed 6 months schedule and the bugfixes to them stop for them pretty
> quickly except for the LTS releases.
> 
> Our schedule differs (much) more. Also, we don't currently provide LTS
> releases (partly because Nokia business model is different, we sell
> products whereas most other Linux distros basically sell services).
> Unlike Ubuntu we have a few bugfix releases (like e.g. Debian has)
> because our releases happen at longer intervals.
> 
> Because of the more radical HW platform differencies between the device
> targets of the Maemo SW releases, we cannot (at least currently) offer
> as good backwards HW compatibility support as can be done on x86.  This
> is something that we need to work with the community (and is currently
> being done e.g. in context of Mer).
> 
> 
> > Now we are cleaning those
> > bugs week after week and yes, this brings lots of WONTFIX among those
> > that are not an issue anymore in Fremantle. It's more a consequence of a
> > past problem than a reflection of a current problem, though.
> 
> 
> 	- Eero
>