Duncan, <br>one more thing (slightly less publicly oriented), doesn't something feel OTT with the development process?<br><br>I came to linux because I knew I might need to touch the metal (prior to this I've coded in .net compact...), you have so many things in the way its hard to know whats real and whats not.<br>
<br>simplicity is the key, I compile directly on my n810 and run with direct hardware and no emulation or vmware or scratchbox or anything and testing is live and I touch my code and its such a liberating feeling!<br><br>
I get better performance on my n810 than I see and hear people getting on other more capable platforms :)<br><br>My framework is very simplistic compared to clutter, but will allow me to build my kind of applications.<br>
For now it is so immature, but if you take a look here:<br><br><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMXp0Dg_UaY">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMXp0Dg_UaY</a><br><br>(and at my other videos) you will see I have broken all the rules but for the right reasons :)<br>
its coming along nicely and I've taken the lessons I learnt with my monolithic app (which was half a framework internally anyway) and am expanding it to cater for outside development.<br><br>Its a little seed that is built from the kind of goodness I expected my handheld to have and will continue to evolve with time and energy<br>
<br>gary<br><br><br><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2009/3/17 Duncan Cragg <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:moby@cilux.org">moby@cilux.org</a>></span><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
<div bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">
Gary:<br>
<br>
I, too, am trying to get my OpenGL ES 2.0 application to work nicely
within the Maemo environment.<br>
<br>
I'm currently testing by killing off the window manager and other
related stuff - back to the old X11 wallpaper pattern, then running my
app. Works fine, as it goes.<br>
<br>
I knew I'd have to come up with a solution one day, but since the
conversation on this list recently (below), I thought I'd take this
opportunity to probe a little deeper.<div class="im"><br>
<br>
> I'm
getting round this by designing my framework to allow both <br>
> standalone
unshared instances to be run (multiple XV overlays <br>
> are allowed) and I
have also put the core principles in place for <br>
> dynamically loading
shared application widgets into the playground.<br>
<br></div>
Fact is, I don't understand this, and was hoping you'd elaborate... =0)<br>
<br>
--------------<br>
<br>
Does anyone else on the list know the Official Maemo Way to develop
OpenGL ES 2.0 applications?<br>
<br>
My approach is that I just run the PowerVR SDK in the X86 mode. I
notice that the lib/.h files have now arrived for cross-compiling to
ARM. <br>
<br>
By the way, it's amazing how many levels and layers you can go through.
In case anyone else is put off trying it: I run in X86 SDK mode to the
PVR ES 2.0 emulation lib, which presumably uses the X86 SDK's GL
libraries and then goes to the Xephyr X11 app. This then runs into my
Ubuntu's X11, which is created by VMWare inside Windows XP inside a
laptop with Intel Graphics chips. (So I'm not expecting great
performance! But it works fine for testing. =0) I get "direct
rendering: Yes" from glxinfo inside my VMWare guest, so there's a
slight chance that there is some acceleration going on somewhere in the
pipes... <br>
<br>
Anyone else got experiences to report?<br>
<br>
Perhaps we should start a wiki page somewhere to give the official
instructions for GL app devs, and to document successes and failures
like this?<br>
<br>
<br>
Cheers!<br>
<br>
Duncan Cragg<font color="#888888"><br>
</font><br>
<div>-- <br>
<b>Q:</b> <i>What's The Killer App for Mobile 2.0?</i><br>
<b>A:</b> See <a href="http://the-u-web.org" target="_blank">http://the-u-web.org</a>
</div>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td>
<div style="display: inline;">Subject: </div>
Re: Clutter in Fremantle (Alpha SDK)</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>
<div style="display: inline;">From: </div>
gary liquid <a href="mailto:liquid@gmail.com" target="_blank"><liquid@gmail.com></a></td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>
<div style="display: inline;">Date: </div>
Tue, 17 Mar 2009 09:28:34 +0000</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td>
<div style="display: inline;">To: </div><div class="im">
Henrik Hedberg <a href="mailto:henrik.hedberg@innologies.fi" target="_blank"><henrik.hedberg@innologies.fi></a></div></td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>
<div style="display: inline;">CC: </div>
<a href="mailto:maemo-developers@maemo.org" target="_blank">maemo-developers@maemo.org</a></td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table><div class="im">
<br>
Hendrik,<br>
<br>
I assume that
to use clutter in your application is to somehow get the window manager
to shutdown the opengl context and then open yours for the duration
before once again reopening the window manager.<br>
<br>
A somewhat challenging prospect!<br>
<br>
Whilst its possible to use x11 compositing to bring in a gtk or qt
window, I assume there is no extension to composite an opengl window
itself.<br>
<br>
And since its "difficult" to allow sharing of data between applications
this is not something that could be fixed elegently.<br>
<br>
really makes you appreciate the underlying beauty of x11 :)<br>
<br>
I'm
getting round this by designing my framework to allow both standalone
unshared instances to be run (multiple XV overlays are allowed) and I
have also put the core principles in place for dynamically loading
shared application widgets into the playground.<br>
<br>
It should be as simple as a change in the makefile to switch a properly
designed application between standalone or shared :)<br>
<br>
gary<br>
<br>
<br>
</div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im">On Tue, Mar 17, 2009 at 7:37 AM, Henrik
Hedberg <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:henrik.hedberg@innologies.fi" target="_blank">henrik.hedberg@innologies.fi</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
</div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"><br>
Hi,<br>
<br><div class="im">
How is Clutter supposed to work in applications in Fremantle? Will<br>
the Clutter-GTK library be included in the final SDK?<br>
<br></div><div class="im">
I have tried to run a Clutter application that works in desktop<br>
environment. It compiles fine, but nothing happens when starting it in<br>
the Alpha SDK. Also, even the simplest example application from<br>
Programming with Clutter tutorial does not work [1].<br>
<br>
Is this somehow related to this statement: "It is assumed that we<br>
will have only one OpenGL drawing context, and thus a single process<br>
running in the system will be using Clutter at a time. This process will<br>
be the window manager and the implementor of all challenging graphical<br>
UI effects on the screen." [2]<br>
<br></div><div class="im">
What is the trick to get a working Clutter stage in Fremantle<br>
application?<br>
<br>
BR,<br>
<br>
Henrik<br>
<br>
[1]<br>
<a href="http://www.openismus.com/documents/clutter_tutorial/0.8/docs/tutorial/html/sec-stage.html#sec-stage-basics" target="_blank">http://www.openismus.com/documents/clutter_tutorial/0.8/docs/tutorial/html/sec-stage.html#sec-stage-basics</a><br>
[2] <a href="http://maemo.org/development/sdks/maemo5_alpha_overview/" target="_blank">http://maemo.org/development/sdks/maemo5_alpha_overview/</a><br>
</div><font color="#888888"><br>
--<div class="im"><br>
Henrik Hedberg - <a href="http://www.henrikhedberg.net/" target="_blank">http://www.henrikhedberg.net/</a><br>
</div></font><br>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
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