Hi, <br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2010/3/8 Benoît HERVIER <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:khertan@khertan.net">khertan@khertan.net</a>></span><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
By this thread i didn't want to launch a debate on why i'm creating my<br>
own repository, but as it s on the table now :<br>
<br>
- There is change in rules that happen frequently which seems to<br>
depends on phase of the moon.<br></blockquote><div><br>Like what ? The CLI rules that took several months to reach a consensus ? <br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
<br>
- There is latency in the display things in the <a href="http://maemo.org/packages/" target="_blank">maemo.org/packages/</a><br>
interface which result of thumb down. Example : Last time i change the<br>
bugtracker link this one was ok in the package but it tooks 3 hours<br>
for this one to be displayed correctly in the web interface -> Result<br>
: thumb down and comment saying that the bug tracker link is wrong ...<br>
and of course other people vote thumb down without verifying nor the<br>
link in the interface nor the link in the control file of the package.<br>
<br>
- Sometimes package is never displayed to the package web interface<br>
.... so cannot promote it.<br>
<br>
- Sometimes promote package result is an php error, which mean that<br>
the package will be not promoted and cannot be anymore without<br>
publishing an other version and try again.<br>
<br>
- Sometimes icon display on the newest package is taken from an older one.<br>
<br>
- Sometimes changelog displayed on the armel version is taken from the<br>
i386 package (occur only when the armel package version of an app is<br>
newer than the i386 one)<br>
<br></blockquote><div><br>Did you filled bug reports about these issues ? <br><br>Best regards,<br><br>-- <br>Valério Valério<br><br><a href="http://www.valeriovalerio.org">http://www.valeriovalerio.org</a><br><br></div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
- I'm not agree with some QA rules, like the fact that you should<br>
point as bug tracker the enter_new.php page so you do not let user<br>
made a search before or display the current know bug, so it ll result<br>
in duplicate bugs.<br></blockquote><div><br><br><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
<br>
- It s look like some users are here just to put thumb down just to<br>
gain some karma.<br>
<br>
Also about bugzilla :<br>
<br>
- Creating a nice user interface to help user to automatically put<br>
bugs directly on the tracker from their nit is not possible ... as<br>
b.m.o use bugzilla and i cannot modify it to accept creation of new<br>
bug from elsewhere than the ui.<br>
<br>
- Submitting bugs require a lot of patience actually, as i take<br>
several minutes to validate it (servers too slow ?) .<br>
<br>
- Asking a new product or version in b.m.o require delay, as it s not<br>
something automated, but require you to send an email.<br>
<br>
And the most important things which guide my decision, is that<br>
currently, many thumb down make me angry as there was wrong vote, and<br>
the fact that i m passing more time to package than to develop didn't<br>
help.<br>
<br>
As all of my apps depends on python, it ll not create a "package<br>
dependancy hell."<br>
<br>
"I am not sure if you were around in the early days", i was, but i<br>
found that actually it s worse. Take a look for example on<br>
<a href="http://maemofrance.fr" target="_blank">maemofrance.fr</a> they say to all their readers that if they want<br>
interesting apps they should add extras-devel in ham... but as you can<br>
see there is many things that can break device in extras-devel<br>
actually.<br>
<div class="im"><br>
"the developers have to understand that the testers are not slaves"<br>
</div>I didn't consider testers as slaves, but i consider today myself as<br>
slave of the qa testing process.<br>
<div class="im"><br>
"If you drop out of Extras then you are not only causing damage to the<br>
community (due to the proliferation of repositories) but also severely<br>
limiting your access to users."<br>
<br>
</div>The purpose isn't to causing damage to the community, but it s<br>
actually too borring to trying to publish things to extras than<br>
creating my own repository which is, i think, actually the better<br>
solution i have ... The worst is stopping all publications of my<br>
applications ... or just put the source code on my web site and<br>
letting user installing it manually. At least i know 3 developpers<br>
currently which consider to not upload to extras. And instead of that<br>
creating there own repository, i didn't know there real reason ... i<br>
just can imagine.<br>
<br>
The other solution i see is creating my own Application Installer ...<br>
there is already two, one for maemo repository and one for ovi ...<br>
adding an other one will be really confuse.<br>
<br>
But if there is someone which want to made the packages and publish it<br>
to extras he is welcome.<br>
<br>
Actually i'm just trying to found the best solution, but i think in a<br>
near future i ll not publish anythings anymore to "extras".<br>
<br>
2010/3/8 Matan Ziv-Av <<a href="mailto:matan@svgalib.org">matan@svgalib.org</a>>:<br>
<div><div></div><div class="h5">> On Mon, 8 Mar 2010, Graham Cobb wrote:<br>
><br>
>> On Monday 08 March 2010 13:09:52 Benoît HERVIER wrote:<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> 2010/3/8 Thomas Perl <<a href="mailto:th.perl@gmail.com">th.perl@gmail.com</a>>:<br>
>>>> "I don't know if Khertan's problem is technical or political"<br>
>>><br>
>>> The both, as i'm tired of fighting against bug and wrong thumb down in<br>
>>> QA Testing.<br>
>><br>
>> Thomas, I was not aware that there was a problem with the autobuilder,<br>
>> with no<br>
>> workround, preventing some packages from building. That is definitely a<br>
>> severe problem and I will certainly push hard for a solution. Thank you<br>
>> for<br>
>> your efforts and your patience.<br>
>><br>
>> Benoît, I am very disappointed that you have decided to create a separate<br>
>> repository. I am not sure if you were around in the early days, with the<br>
>> 770, but the proliferation of repositories made things unmanageable for<br>
>> both<br>
>> users and developers, even with the very small number of users we had<br>
>> then.<br>
>> The problem was not just finding packages: the worst problems were<br>
>> incompatabilites that prevented two packages from even being installed on<br>
>> the<br>
>> same system! Re-creating that mess is no solution to even the most serious<br>
>> problems we have today.<br>
><br>
> Why not have another repository (called extras-authors), describe it as<br>
> repository of programs that their authors think are good enough for users,<br>
> and allow authors sole discretion on promoting their packages from<br>
> extras-devel to extras-authors. As long as the name is neutral, and the<br>
> wiki/forum/mail-list are not full of warnings in size 72 blinking red<br>
> letters that this repository certainly without any doubt will destroy your<br>
> device, I am sure most of those who have seperate repositories will prefer<br>
> to use such repository. I know that I will.<br>
> After all, this is how extras repository worked in chinook/diablo, and I<br>
> think it worked very well.<br>
><br>
><br>
> --<br>
> Matan.<br>
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><br>
><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
</div>--<br>
<div class="im">Benoît HERVIER - <a href="http://khertan.net/" target="_blank">http://khertan.net/</a><br>
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