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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>We had this discussion not long ago (<a
href="http://maemo.org/community/maemo-developers/maemo_qa_process/?org_openpsa_qbpager_net_nemein_discussion_posts_page=1">http://maemo.org/community/maemo-developers/maemo_qa_process/?org_openpsa_qbpager_net_nemein_discussion_posts_page=1</a>)<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I think the “appdownloader”
has most of features we need to help users find, install, test and review
applications. If we also add to the appdownloader reminders like “you
installed xxxx 10 days ago, how would you rate it?” we would have a much
more effective process. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>An initial (to do) list (comments anyone?):<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<ol style='margin-top:0in' start=1 type=1>
<li class=MsoNormal style='color:navy;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo2'><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>I
assume appdownloader is open source but I would contact the developer to
see if he is interested on taking the application to the “next level”.
We also need someone on the server side to help.<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
<li class=MsoNormal style='color:navy;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo2'><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>add
extras-testing to appdownloader (probably requires changes on the server).
Application would only show “testing applications” if the
repository is enabled.<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
<li class=MsoNormal style='color:navy;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo2'><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>show
the source of the package and optionally allow to filter “only
extras” <o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
<li class=MsoNormal style='color:navy;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo2'><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>automatically
add comments from appdownloader to the application test page<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
<li class=MsoNormal style='color:navy;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo2'><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>still
have some “official testers” feedback required… most
users won’t care about the “qa checklist” but I think
their feedback should be as important on deciding if the application gets
promoted or not. <o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
<li class=MsoNormal style='color:navy;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo2'><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>add
“desktop” and close buttons to appdownloader (please?)<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
<li class=MsoNormal style='color:navy;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo2'><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>remember
credentials so user does not have to login again?<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
<li class=MsoNormal style='color:navy;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo2'><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>keep
track of the applications that the user has installed. Show reminders
every “x” days after installation<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
<li class=MsoNormal style='color:navy;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo2'><font size=2
color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Maybe
integrate appdownloader to FAP? Anything we can do to make easier to
install applications using appdownloader<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
</ol>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Sorry for repeating myself but I really
believe we may have a solution we can actually implement and help a lot with
this issue and some others. It is great to have more applications but it is
getting harder every day to find them and decide to install or not. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Felipe<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
maemo-developers-bounces@maemo.org [mailto:maemo-developers-bounces@maemo.org] <b><span
style='font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Attila Csipa<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Wednesday, September 22,
2010 8:58 AM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> Polyvertex<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Cc:</span></b> maemo-developers@maemo.org<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: Package promoting</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>On Wed, Sep 22, 2010 at 3:09 PM, Polyvertex <<a
href="mailto:polyvertex@gmail.com">polyvertex@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;
margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><br>
I think the maintainer should always have the ability to promote the<br>
package to extras by himself and take the risk of being under fire<br>
from users if he promote a very bad/bugged release and did not took<br>
enough time to resolve issues. This may also be added to the Karma<br>
system if this is not already done.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'><br>
Generally, that was the setup with the N8x0 and Maemo4.x, so we have tried that
- IMO this works better (occasional developer frustration notwithstanding) from
a user standpoint, so let's not backpedal on that - do everything to make it
simpler for developers, but do not sacrifice users in the process. Reflashing
might be trivial for some, but a serious endeavour for others.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;
margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in'>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>> A secret weapon is
in the making - KISStester, which would allow easier<br>
> feedback for users, and it also acts as a REMINDER for people who are
using<br>
> software that is in dire need of testing (the problem is that people<br>
> *download* things from testing but forget/can't be bothered to come BACK
to<br>
> vote on it).<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>Well... As both of us
said : most of the time, users don't vote. This<br>
is why the promoting process is way too constraining : it does not<br>
take users behavior into account at all...<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'><br>
We'll see the effects when KISStester lands. The point is that ofter people
don't even *know* they are downloading the version from extras-testing (since
H-A-M does not show that info - and they might have installed it before it was
promoted to extras-testing), they are forgetful, etc. So it's not like 99.999%
of users don't care, it's just the process that is awkward for most. If we as
much as double user response by flashing a 'hey, you have used this app from
testing for N days now, care to give some feedback ?' in notifications (or 'you
have uninstalled an app from extras-testing, was there something wrong with it
?'), that would already be big help. At that point the biggest concern will be
educating people of leaving *good* feedback, but if we have bad results, we can
always disable the vote-part and just leave comments - that can be very
helpful, too.<br>
<br>
PS also for feedback - I often see for example problems being reported on talk
- that goes to show that people are not comfortable with leaving comments
within the testing process, so silence in testing does not necessarily mean all
is well (but it does mean the process needs refining).<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'>Best regards,<br>
Attila<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
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