[maemo-users] Not enough memory

From: Craig Woodward woody at rochester.rr.com
Date: Thu Feb 18 01:01:41 EET 2010
---- Christian Walther <cptsalek at gmail.com> wrote: 
>sorry, I have to agree with Johan -- it is crap.
>A living and healthy ecosystem consists of 

... consists of keep track of your own ecosystem usage.  I don't take a crap on my dining room table, just like I don't install random software on my computer without watching what it does.  I have tons of apps installed from various repositories, and was able to do the update OTA without any issues.  How?  Because when I installed apps I watched my "ecosystem" and hand-optified one or two packages that I liked and wanted to keep that took a lot of rootfs space.  If you dump wherever you please, and don't watch where you're walking, you have little room to complain about stepping in your own mess later.

>For the user it simply shouldn't matter where a package comes from, as
>long as this package has been built using the official tools "and
>stick to the rules" everything should be fine.

They have that.  It's called an iPhone.  You can only install things built with the official tools that force everyone to "stick to the rules".  I got an N900 because I don't like Apple's rules (namely I like to do more than 1 thing at a time).

As for people screaming "the iPhone updates don't have this problem!", you are correct.  They also don't offer major upgrades every other month.  They also don't publicize how often people needed to take their phone in to iCare centers to get updated, which has happened a lot.  The iPhone also doesn't let you install apps from wherever you please, or offer a free SDK package so you can make and install your own apps for free.  There are a lot of things the iPhone doesn't let you do... and if you break the rules (jail breaking), updates are next to impossible.  Recall how long it took for update 1 from iPhone to bring MMS to it?  One year!  For the N900 we had it in the devel repositories in under a month (kudos to frals).

If you wanted an iPhone, you should have bought one.  You don't shave with a bowling pin... buy the right tool for the right job.  If you bought the wrong tool on impusle, please don't whine about it.  Nokia and Maemo are known quantities, and a little research before the purchase (or before installing ioquake) would have told you this is not a computer for someone that don't know how to maintain a computer.

As for having such a "tiny FS", my understanding is that was done because the first area of the flash is a different class (faster speed == more expensive) to enhance performance.  There are discussion threads where people talk about having repartitioned their phone, or swapping rootfs and swap partitions around to have more rootfs at the cost of speed or less swap space.  If you want to do that, YOU CAN. (Try that on an iPhone.)  Reality is there are practical limitations on memory performance and cost.  Nokia made a trade off to keep the production costs down, Maemo worked with that, and it's something that most people can live with.

>Apart from that, I really can't understand why Nokia doesn't supply
>tools that allow to build clean packages

Most phone providers don't supply ANY SDK for their phones.  Nokia at least provides something, and encourages others to create and distribute tools based on their designs.  Can you imagine if a Debian virtual box image based on eclipse came out developing iPhone apps?  They'd be off bumped off the net in hours, and sued into oblivion by Apple.  Yet just such a download exists for the N900, and several other Nokia based phones.

Maemo DOES have tools that optimize for the phone.  It's a simple, well documented thing to turn optification on.  The fact of the matter is that it can make debugging harder at times, so some developers don't enable it at first.  For some major packages, (libraries, like python for example) it's a little more complex, especially for items not made specifically for the N900.  Sometimes you have to branch off your own changes, and until you have time to do that, you want to get basic functionality working.

I swear I've never heard so much whining about a trivial topic in my life.  You'd think Nokia was pushing a completely closed release from the yelping going on. You installed 80 apps from unstable or random repositories and sources, each time with a pop-up from the OS saying that what you're doing is unsupported and could cause device instability.  And now you're complaining because an update is asking you to fix some of the damage you've done so it can do an upgrade?  It's called being an adult.  If you can't handle it, stick to the toys for 12 and under from now on.

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